I have requested a detail information abut LCF-064-1P,

     Enphase - datasheet only

     Manufacturer - can not provide it because customized item

 

No more solution, I have decided to return the filter on Enphase,

 

So, I start to find the solution on my way,

 

I have reinstalled RP230-30-10-S and GTX-2300

 

    BUT, it has too high line loss, so, I have checked GTX-2300 to remove it.

    the coil configuration is the two-in-hand winding, it is good for common filter becuase lower leakage

but, not good for differential. it means, it is not much useful for me.

    so, I have removed it. and, reduce 0.5mA leakage current & 10mOhm Resistance Loss

 

     ferrite_winding.png

       It is similar situation, RP230-30-10-S have 60dB 50/50 insertion loss, but, can not block

the signal from next door, because too quiet in background noise, and no one use PLC devices.

so, just Envoy signal can be detected too easily.

 

      so, I have detected to install a differential filter using ferrite

 

rp230-double_d.png

 

Ferrite core is B64290L0082X065

 

and, look the direction, it is the coupled differential mode, and 2 pass

over one day, verified, it can isolated successfuly, the expected core loss is 200-300Wh per year. 

it is much less than 1~2kWh in GTX-2300-Y02. 

 

This configuration will be saturated under 5A. so, I have tried on single pass.

at least, I need 10A because higher current will act as a noise, and will reduce the sensitivity of enovy.

and, I just need this inductor is working at the lower current (quite) zone.

 

rp230-single_d.png

 

This is final, configuration.

It is working well, now, my system has isolated completely.

and, no more cross-domain-traffic issue.

 

The cost of Ferrite & RP230 filter is just $80, and under $100 include tax & shipping.

It will working when system current is under 24A (around 20, IQ7+),

If want to apply on the bigger system, need bigger filter

 

 

 

 

AB71E8E4-2B47-4EEC-9AC0-680B57489861 

I have installed shortest wiring, and no overlap to avoid a crosstalk, and just put one Ferrite core to filter a common mode for wire organizing and 10cm overcome earth wires. It may affect on the high frequency, but, it is not our concern because LCF is for 110kHz L-to-L PLC & Noise filtering now.
 

Let me check what will happening, 

 

Updated on NOV 29 2021

 

Long story is short, It is not working

 

LCF.png

This is an error what I do not want to get..

I have requested some advice and, Enphase said

 

Avoid a magnetic PLC coupling by

  - Own enclouser :: it is related with a distance, but, -.-a

  - 12" distance between conductor  :: point to point is not important, parallel run is the key

 

Anyway, I have installed as

 

LCF_ext.png

 

If I add an enclouser for the filter, I have to get a permit & inspection from local office. it become so complicated issue. and, I feel, so strange, the engineer do not understand what is the real problem.

 

anyway, I am not sure what is the cause why it can not block the signal from my next door, 

i understand as it is a customized part for IQ. Maybe it is just a issue of my part. 

 

while low current, Enovy is detecting the other enovy at outside.

IT is happening because my house has very quite in electric noise.

if not cut-out completely, the filter is not enough because still high SNR. 

 

It is happening becuase too quite !!!

 

Very good video what is difference between Mico and String Inverters

 

 

Micro vs String Inverter

 

 

You have to watch it before install a solar system.

 

Enphase MI system is much expensive than String inverter,

even more than Optimizer system.

 

But, String inverter system need 6+ panels in series, it means there is a minimum number of panels under similar sun-light condition. but, MI system do not have the minimum requirments, technically 1 panel.

 

so, if have small zone & multi zones (more than 2), MI should be better

except this condition, There is no advantage via the extra cost

We knew Enphase Envoy and Inverters are communicating using Power Line Carrier,

 

The Envoy IQ is using Line-to-Line Singal instead Envoy-S's Line-to-N/G Signal.

 

It is a huge difference, because Envoy IQ is generating Differential mode signal

and, OLD Envoy is generating Common mode signal

 

To filter the signal from my neighborhood (he has installed Solar System last summer, unfotunately, he & I under the same utility tranformer). To solve the cross domain traffic issue, I need to filter the differential mode signal.

 

I have installed RP230-30-10-S between IQ combiner busbar And Wire_to_load_center.

It is suggested for Envoy-S (Line-to-N/G) system. but, Double stage filter has a good filtering on DM signal. Especially, this model shows 60dB insertion loss on DM. so, I have expected, it will filter the signal.

 

Insertion Loss (dB) = 20 * log10 ( Unfiltered / Filtered)

60dB means, 20 * 3 = 1000/1, the signal should be filtered by 1/1000 at 150kHz

Even consider some decay at 100kHz, the filtering performance should be 1/100 or better.

Leakage current of this filter is 1.8mA, it is pretty high loss

 

https://www4.enphase.com/sites/default/files/Power_Line_Filter_Single-Phase_TechBrief.pdf?utm_source=community&utm_medium=answer_links&utm_campaign=internal_reference

 

DC0A11E8-EB68-4EFD-9056-FA03F0716AE8 

 

but, envoy is showing ‘Communications from other Envoy(s) have been detected’ early morning. And it is disappearing till evening, and showing again.

 

I have installed GTX-2300-Y02 between Wire_from_envoy and Breaker_Load_Center

 

Insersion loss is around 20dB in common mode. there is no differential value.

I am expecting around 10dB minimum, but, the leakage current is 0.5mA,

Too expensive to use it,

 

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/KEMET/GTX-2300-Y02?qs=yqaQSyyJnNgbwvs18djAZg%3D%3D

 

4F2F6189-9337-4344-910D-39322A18EA18 

 

Load center and combiner has located as below

 

854901D7-5E75-4C70-95EB-4E6484BAACDF 

 

MI - Combiner - RP230 - GTX2300 - Critical Load Center - XW 6848 - Main Load Center - Grid

 

Unfutunately, it can not solve the issue,

the message come again and again ~ like a die hard ....

 

Wait a minitue, just thinking again,

 

Common mode signal.JPG

 

New Envoy is Line-to-Line communication, so, I have to remove/block a differential mode signal,

it means, the common mode filter is not working.

 

  • Envoy-S    same as Common Mode Signal
  • Envoy-IQ   same as Differential Signal

 

If install Ferrite Core on L1/L2, yes, it should not working -.-, that is just for old Enovy ONLY. !!!!

 

GTX-2300, it is a typical single stage common filter, it is good on common noise, and, have some filter for differential mode noise, i feel, that is not strong enough.

 

 

 

and, RP230-30-10, It is double stage filter, it have 60dB insertion loss on DM at 150kHz.

 

 

Unfotunately, those filters can not block the signal and, my envoy still detect the other Envoy(s). 

 

 

BUT, I feel so strange,

 

(1) it is detected when early morning  - when MIs start to work

(2) it is detected when evening - when MIs stop to work

(3) sometime at evening

 

so, I have tried to check the noise level and filtering level using SA

 

DAD3F7CA-2C54-4621-B374-745F5F4EF95C

 

it makes me so disappointed, because I can not detect any signal from outside for couple of hours.

I have checked my device again, turn-on Enovy and check the signal

 

EFEA448A-695F-48BB-81AA-97C57963B82D

 

My equiment can detect a communication signal which has been generating from my Envoy.

I can find a signal, and confirm the filtering even I can not find the exact level of filtering.

 

[SO, THERE IS A BASIC QUESTION]

 

How my Envoy detect the other Envoy(s) signal ?

How my Envoy detect the other Envoy(s) signal after 2 filters ? there is 60dB insertion loss. Is it possible to be detected ?

 

ANYWAY, most power line filter is designed to minimize the power loss using small capacitor.

It means, not strong enogh on DM filtering, BUT, can not explain the the message while low power mode. Because filter will lost the performance while higher current mode,

 

I have ordered Q-LCF-064-1P-1 to make sure,

 

Because it said, IQ compatible,

 

75W maximum loss (via the maximum current), should be under 1/16 at my appliaction.

anyway, around ~19Wh is so high power consumption 

 

75W x 1/16 & 4.15h = 19Wh per day (or 7.1kWh per year)


Maybe need to try for the DM mode noise

This is showing how cable has connected and where is the panel/inverter has installed on my roof.

 

layout_a.png

 

This is an simple electric node diagram,

Pretty complex tree than my expectation,

When I have chance, I should clean-up and optimize the wire routing.

becuase I found so many duplicate path, and far routings.

 

(1) remove cap from top route (between 12-13)

(2) install cap on end of 07

(3) move jumper wire between bottom and middle route, on top - middle

(4) move JB-middle to JB-bottom

 

and then, Break #1 route will have 9 inverters (longest 6 node)

and, Breaker #2 route will have 6 inverters,

 

for this job, jumper cable should enought to jump from mid to top.

little doubt ...

 

Maybe need

    50' Q-cable

    2  female connector to make an extension cable

    1  terminator

    1  cap

    1  connector disassembly clip/jig

 

Actually, the best method is

    (1) make an extra route from bottom to JB

    (2) update JB

 

But, need enough wire clips ...... so many....

 

layout_b.png

 

The most people charge thier computer or smart phone frequently, and try to keep in full charge status.

They have to understand that is the worst habit to use a lithium chemistry.

 

When keep the high charge status over long time, battery degradation is happening.

Will lost capacity permanently, this damage can be increased with the temperature of battery (device).

 

This is why no one recommend do not keep charging all the time, to reduce the average status of charge.

 

 

 

IMG_2308.jpeg

 

I have 10kWh (51.2V, 200Ah) battery pack already.

But, it is not enough to back-up 2-3 days.

So, I have ordered custom battery pack module (total $6,000 include delivery/bus-bar box).

Each battery pack have 5kWh (51.2V, 100Ah) capacity.

 

Total 30kWh will enough

     2 days     without 0 solar production in winter season

     3 days     with 50% solar production in winter season

     unlimited  with 100% solar production in winter season

 

My power usage is around 12~16kWh in winter,  

The full solar production is just 10~13kWh in winter, I have to install an extra panels to support full power demand. and planing on this summer

 

     1.4kWAC panel for grid-tie, expected 2~3kWh extra in winter season

     0.7kWDC panel for battery back-up, expected 1kWh exra in winter season

 

Basically, no need to worry in spring/fall/summer, solar panel can generate more than a day amount.

just need a night back-up

 

 

Battery.jpeg

 

Install Schneider XW Pro (6848 Inverter/Charger) for an emergency back-up at home.

I have finished in 2020, but, Just found an installation photo.

 

I have add 2/3" Plywood on the wall to hold the inverter, it is so heavy (137lb),

And, prepared back-feed to main breaker panel for whole house power.

 

Inverter / Conduit Box / Gateway / SCP / Extra electric parts (wire / breaker / interlock / conduit / .....),

Total cost is around $5,000

 

 

IMG_2273.JPEG

 

IMG_2274.JPEG